PS3 outselling Wii in Japan during 2009 – but for how long?
Japan is the home of both Nintendo and Sony, which means competition in the country between the two gaming giants has always been brutal. After Sony won two generations in a row in Japan, as it did everywhere else, this generation has seen Nintendo dominant. The Wii has so far kicked the PS3’s behind, but the times they are a-changing.
Last month brought news from Japan that sales of the Wii may have peaked at last. Not only was the PS3 selling well on a weekly basis, it also managed to top the Wii for the whole month of March – for the first time in 16 months.
April has continued to show this trend, the Wii going down, the PS3 going up. Media Create hardware sales between April 13 and April 19 show that the Sony console is once again dominating proceedings, with the Wii dropping substantially.
Japanese Hardware Sales – W/E 04/19
Playstation 3 – 62,527
PSP – 40,065
Nintendo DSi – 38,287
Nintendo Wii – 13,221
Xbox 360 – 8,652
Nintendo DS – 6,438
Playstation 2 – 4,230
Granted, this result was clearly down to the Blu-ray release of Final Fantasy 7: Advent Children, with a special version of the PS3, and a demo of the upcoming Final Fantasy XIII. But still, these numbers are impressive.
They also mean that the PS3 has now overtaken the Wii in terms of year-to-date sales for 2009. The Playstation 3 is currently sitting at 447,700 units sold, with the Nintendo Wii just behind on 431,833 units sold so far.
I’ve asked before (on a few different occasions) whether the Wii’s days are numbered? And been shouted down for my opinion that this may well be the case. But this is further evidence to support the theory that, in Japan at least, the Wii may have reached saturation point.
However, for a Wii non-fan such as myself, there are a couple of dark spots on the horizon in the form of Wii MotionPlus and Wii Sports Resort. If the former manages to make the motion-sensing experience a lot more accurate and pleasing then that could well reinvigorate hardware sales. And Wii Sports is now the bestselling game of all time, so its sequel is likely to be huge.
The PS3 is certainly showing signs of growth in Japan, and this is coupled with a decline in fortunes for the Wii. However, the jury is still out as to whether this trend will continue. I, for one, certainly hope so.
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April 26th, 2009
Yeah it was just a matter of time. When Final Fantasy XIII and Final Fantasy Versus XIII come out both exclusive to the PlayStation 3 Sony is going to have a wonderful time returning back to #1.
In the end Sony’s PLAYSTATION 3 will beat every record set by any PlayStation system.
April 26th, 2009
“Yeah it was just a matter of time. When Final Fantasy XIII and Final Fantasy Versus XIII come out both exclusive to the PlayStation 3 Sony is going to have a wonderful time returning back to #1.
In the end Sony’s PLAYSTATION 3 will beat every record set by any PlayStation system.”
@Ivan_PSP
LOL, easy there Ivan, still a little ways to go before your “prediction” comes true. When I say little, I mean about another 130 or so million more PS3’s sold. You also realize FF 13 is only exclusive in Japan? Still though, when that comes out I think the PS3 is going to have a nice bump in sales (in Japan at least). Considering how expensive the PS3 is, those numbers are very impressive. Can’t say I really see the rosey future you forecast for PS3 Ivan, but PS3 is certainly doing fine. Looking forward to the rest of this gen that PS3 has to offer, some amazing games on the way!
April 26th, 2009
“Yeah it was just a matter of time. When Final Fantasy XIII and Final Fantasy Versus XIII come out both exclusive to the PlayStation 3 Sony is going to have a wonderful time returning back to #1″ (Ivan_PSP 1).
FYI FFXIII has been announced on the 360. I don’t get why people keep claiming it’ll be an exclusive.
April 26th, 2009
I think you’re right: there is still a long way to go, but I also think that there is a very good chance that the PS3 could beat the Wii (2009 Japan).
In addition to FFXIII, there are also a lot of other titles being released in the region that will surely help gather momentum. For instance Tekken, Ninja Gaiden, Tales of Vespiera, & many others, will all be big sellers for the PS3 in Japan.
I’m not sure if Punch will have the same appeal to the Japaneses audience. Yes, there will be Wii Sports 2, but Nintendo’s over all line up is anorexic in comparison.
Sure the Wii is cheap, but the Wii’s crappy game offering is driving consumers to shell out the extra few bucks for a decent console.
April 26th, 2009
The Wii hasn’t even sold a million wow and i know that Final Fantasy XIII is only exclusive to PLAYSTATION in Japan and Final Fantasy Versus XIII is exclusive worldwide. I applaud you realizing the the PS3 has awesome kick ass games. You do realize that by the time that games launches the PS3 would have drop in price. Even though the price is fine. And Wii has a horrible lineup and Xbox nothing.
April 26th, 2009
lol if Nintendo charges $250 for a Wii… the PS3 should be 5 times that easily.
April 26th, 2009
Wow, now it’s a whole month on the basis of 2 game releases as well as 2 single weeks.
I bet those boys at Nintendo are just quaking as the sky falls in on them right now.
Not.
BTW Ivan the Xbox has just sold it’s 1,000,000th unit in Japan so I think it’s pretty safe to say the Wii passed that little landmark long ago.
April 26th, 2009
“Wow, now it’s a whole month on the basis of 2 game releases as well as 2 single weeks.
I bet those boys at Nintendo are just quaking as the sky falls in on them right now.
Not.
BTW Ivan the Xbox has just sold it’s 1,000,000th unit in Japan so I think it’s pretty safe to say the Wii passed that little landmark long ago.”
@Happyhockum
Point taken happy, 2 games alone is not going to keep this going for long. However IMO there is alot more to offer from the PS3 then the Wii in 2009. If PS3 keeps cranking out the games it’s very possible PS3 can keep out selling it and take over the install base in Japan (though I’m not exactly holding my breath). Either way your right, Nintendo has already made a TON of cash off the Wii, they should not worry about it either way! What systems do you own Happy?
April 26th, 2009
Happy owns an xbox 360 and hates the playstation 3.
April 26th, 2009
“I bet those boys at Nintendo are just quaking as the sky falls in on them right now.”
-Didn’t Nintendo issue a statement acknowledging that the Wii is starting to slip? Also Wii sales are even down 17% in the US this year.
Wildstrike – Yes, Happy will always resort to the “PS3 sux. Masta Chief powns face” argument, even if it is completely off topic.
April 26th, 2009
Wildstrike (and Barnabee for that matter too)
Unlike yourselves I do not have ‘hate’ or ‘love’ when it comes to it for a game console.
It’s a CE item, wake up.
So I’ll happily leave all that idiocy for you fanboys.
Ever since the ‘PS3 uber alles’ PR sh*te came out it’s just been so easy to take the pi$$ out of you ladies.
April 26th, 2009
The way you present yourself, it comes across as a very distinct dislike of the ps3 or anything sony HH.
You need a more neutral tone in your posts.
I hate how ms try to monopolize every venture they have and their PR is also something I dislike (Sony is also guilty of this, although they have toned down in recently, prob due to not so stellar start to the ps3 – humble pie)
So what I am trying to say is that the same sh%te you hate about sony, is the same crap that ms does now, whether you accept that or not.
April 26th, 2009
If I were talking that sort of stupidity about Microsoft and proclaiming to ‘love’ their stuff you might have a point Spideydog.
But, as I don’t, you don’t.
April 27th, 2009
Japan Shmapan.
April 27th, 2009
@ Barnabe Jones,
“Yes, Happy will always resort to the “PS3 sux. Masta Chief powns face” argument, even if it is completely off topic.”
Pot meet kettle….
April 27th, 2009
look, in japan, Final Fantasy and GT are “THE” games. FF is there super bowl, there F.A cup final, there Australia v Uragay in 2005 to go into the world cup finals.
its going to be massive over there… it’s going to dwarf anything we have seen this gen in JAPAN… don’t get me wrong, it will sell great everywhere else as well… but % Japan will have the most… i just don’t think that the impact of the japan sales alone will make all that much difference in the long run…
FF13 will sell more on ps3 then 360… SFIV sold basicly 50-50 with a fair few more 360s out there without the game having a history of mainly being on one console… and with (and dont kid yourselfs on this fact) ps3 version being its true vision of the game (atleast i hope they don’t edit it down for everyone outside Japan) that this will sell like hot cakes on PS3 more so then 360…
Japan for this game isn’t the make or break for sony… sony needa advertise the game with a PS3 logo at the end of the ad… what 360 did with a fair few games… this game, FF13 versus and GT5 along with uncharted 2 should be the make or break point in the PS3 life
btw anyone know the record for most games sold on a launch day? cause i think this may get close to it if you look at the JAP/EU/US launch days and add them up
April 27th, 2009
@Spidey Why wouldn’t any company try to rule their line of business? That’s the point of if.
I would if it was me and I know you would if it was you. If you say otherwise then you’re a liar.
The Wii sports is only Number 1 because it is bundled. Wii sport2 will sell ok because they will probably bundle it next.
I thing the Wii is almost done too. But they did very well no matter what happens now.
I am rooting for Sony because it is a great consol but really don’t care because I have mine and don’t care if anyone else buys one.
I also have a Wii that the kids play. But now they play Little big planet more.
Add me on PSN “ncaissie” from Canada.
April 27th, 2009
Great news for PS3 owners…if they play their cards right, Sony can do awesome this year…I hope all the consoles do great, but i would like to see Sony back on top, with Nintendo 2nd and MS 3rd..just in that order…We all know what happens when MS leads a market…but i don’t want them out..they surely humbled Sony this generation…
As for Happy…yes he is the most blind MS fanboy here
April 27th, 2009
jojo29:
“As for Happy…yes he is the most blind MS fanboy here”
Taking the pi$$ out of the PS3 fanboys (often when they start talking b*llocks about the PS3 v the Wii) and correcting their laughably one-eyed anti-Microsoft bias makes me “the most blind MS fanboy” does it?
LMAO
April 27th, 2009
You can’t fault the guy/gal for forming an opinion of you based on posts from an online ‘forum’ (of sorts).
I have to say that you do come across as almost a 360 fanboy… BUT thats probably my fault for not noticing that times when you’ve actually said that Sony has actually done certain things right and MS has done other things wrong.
Sadly it seems we only ever remember the ‘bad’ things
April 27th, 2009
SW
I think it’s just that there are a few of the PS3 fans on here who will repeat any old sh*te so long as it takes a dig at the Xbox and/or Microsoft.
I take a perverse enjoyment in taking that sort of cr@p apart.
They’re straight out of the ‘with us or against us’ line in stupidity.
If I’m not letting their BS pass and come along & take the pi$$ about it then I must be a ‘Microsoft fanboy’.
To a PS3 fanboy.
That’s not exactly much to care less about.
I make it no secret & I have said several times I have family & friends with PS3s.
My own choice (long considered I might add) was for the Xbox (especially at the fantastic price – I first of all got a new 60gb console for £120, then sold that and got all my money back & got a new Elite for £135).
If you like your PS3 good luck to you.
If you want to pretend that it’s the most amazing technical advance since the silicon chip was invented then prepare for some pi$$ taking.
Sony’s debacle with Blu-ray (inextricably linked to the whole PS3 fiasco) just makes it even more amusing.
April 27th, 2009
See the above paragraph is why you are deemed, a blind fanboy, you take pot shots at the PS3 fans for
‘repeat-ing any old sh*te so long as it takes a dig at the Xbox and/or Microsoft.” <—this is exactly what you do pretty much every other post, hypocrit much?
As for this:
“My own choice (long considered I might add) was for the Xbox (especially at the fantastic price – I first of all got a new 60gb console for £120, then sold that and got all my money back & got a new Elite for £135).”
My choice was for the PS3, mainly because it comes with FANTASTIC value, Playstation 3 AND a Blu-Ray Player? With built-in wireless and FREE online play? At the time i picked up Heavenly Sword/Lair(hey i liked it)/Resistance were all the rage
And my turn to take a potshot
“If you like your PS3 good luck to you.”
No my friend, if you like your 360, good luck to you that it DOES NOT break any time soon, what with the RROD still roaming around the 16%+ (33% is more like it because of the following) thats NOT even including the recent E74, errors, no my friend, i wish YOU the best of luck..
“If you want to pretend that it’s the most amazing technical advance since the silicon chip was invented then prepare for some pi$$ taking.”
If you want to pretend a 3 year warranty gives you the most technically advanced machine then prepare for some heating/E74/RROD issues, along with a nice minimum 1 week delay for getting your broken xbox back….
“Sony’s debacle with Blu-ray (inextricably linked to the whole PS3 fiasco) just makes it even more amusing.”"
Not only has it paid off ( Blu Ray says are not declining, but steadily, tortoise like even, GAINING as more and more people make the move to HDTVs:) ) and i for one don’t regret it, my Blu Library is slowing growing as well, and that not even if i go ahead and rebuy older DvDs ( which i havent, minus 300 )
April 27th, 2009
Just for good measure, i have never claimed NOT to be a Sony fanboy, I’m just not a BLIND Sony Fanboy the way you are a BLIND MS fanboy…
Im NOT blind to the fact that:
-Sony’s arrogance has cost them dearly, but they have been making great strides, this article is proof of that
-Sony NEEDS MORE marketing, they can take a que from MS on this.
-Sony needs to take a que from Nintendo and drop the price already.
These are the 3 key things i believe has hurt Sony the most. It would have been 4) Games, NEVER release a system with such a drought, they got extremely lucky, IMO, but they have since rememdied that and now have a MUCH MUCH better stream of quality 1st party games out and/or on the way than MS.
Free-online has really paid off for them. THAT was a MAJOR reason ( call it stupid if you want, but its one of my reasons nonetheless) i would never buy a xbox…I don’t like getting charged for things that every other system on the planet offers for FREE and then tries to justify it with features that are also FREE ( Nintendos Online is Free, PC gaming is free online (minus MMORPGS) Sony’s online if free, why in the world would i pay MS for it…again my opinion on that call it dumb if you wish but that is the reason..
April 27th, 2009
Oh on top of that you keep spitting out “MS’ ‘industry leading’ warranty”. <–that is funny
Nintendo and Sony DO NOT NEED that warranty because quite frankly, their systems do not fail…
April 27th, 2009
HH – “If I were talking that sort of stupidity about Microsoft and proclaiming to ‘love’ their stuff you might have a point Spideydog.
But, as I don’t, you don’t.”
You can’t be serious ????!!!!
My point stands m8, you are contradicting yourself.
April 27th, 2009
jojo29:
“Nintendo and Sony DO NOT NEED that warranty because quite frankly, their systems do not fail…”
Rubbish.
No-one makes a 100% perfect product everytime.
You’ve got to be seriously deluded to imagine (and then publicly say) long warranties are a bad thing and something to criticise a company for providing.
Spideydog
Sorry matey but you might have an impression (I can do nothing about that) but just because I enjoy ripping the pi$$ out of the ‘PS3 to rule the world’ gang of idiots that does not make me madly ‘in love’ with Microsoft.
Sorry old chum but it just doesn’t.
Nor does telling the more complete truth about Xbox when the whiners come in to do their (invariably) laughable, sometimes ignorant, selective & ridiculously biased bash about it.
April 28th, 2009
I don’t think anyone is saying a long warranty is bad, I think what MS did was very good (if not thier only ‘real’ choice) but you have to admit there would be no need for it if the 360’s, at least the earlier ones, weren’t so prone to failure.
April 28th, 2009
If the 360 had launched with a 3y warranty, there would be some validity to the fanboys parading it as a positive thing, but it was purely a CYA move by MS to cover their broken product.
Any other interpretation of the warranty extension is only a negative reflection upon the claimant.
April 28th, 2009
Quote: “Spideydog
Sorry matey but you might have an impression (I can do nothing about that) but just because I enjoy ripping the pi$$ out of the ‘PS3 to rule the world’ gang of idiots that does not make me madly ‘in love’ with Microsoft.
Sorry old chum but it just doesn’t.
Nor does telling the more complete truth about Xbox when the whiners come in to do their (invariably) laughable, sometimes ignorant, selective & ridiculously biased bash about it.
1. I could say the same about your xbot buddies m8 !!
2. I was not talking about whether you are “madly in love with ms” I was talking about the way you come across in your posts. You come across that way (even if you aren’t)
My point still stands………
April 28th, 2009
3 year warranty for XBox 360’s due to estimated 16.4% failure rate of original XBox 360… 3 year warranty extends to all 360’s… however, if you happen to be one of the estimated 3%+ who have your PS3/Wii fail you are SOoL outside of a year. If their hardware is so great, why cannot they at least match Microsoft’s warranty? Because they don’t need to as not as many people can call them out on it? I could be wrong, but I believe this is HappyHockum’s point. BTW HH, what is your gamertag? Mine is USMC MSgt B, anybody here is welcome to invite.
April 28th, 2009
“I believe this is HappyHockum’s point.”
Yes, and its flawed.
April 28th, 2009
Ugh I should correct that.
Here we go :
“I believe this is HappyHockum’s point.”
If it is, then its flawed.
April 28th, 2009
Spideydog
Oh well, I’ll just have to find a way to live with the the fact we agree to disagree then. Nevermind, that’s what adults do, right?
SW
The only thing flawed here is that anyone would carp and bitch about a 3yr warranty.
Let’s be honest here, the only reason they do is to attempt to deflect any fair-minded neutral seeing a positive point from it being there in the first place.
Once they have done their regulation ’statement of the bleeding obvious’
(that the 1st version Xbox 360 ought not to have had a fail rate of 16% or so)
there’s really nothing left to say about that.
(Other than to clarify that they are talking about the 1st SKU with those sorts of tales.)
It did and so they both changed the SKU and then they gave everyone peace of mind by introducing the 3yr deal
(which included every Xbox 360 sold from day 1 – if you’re a modder and flashed your 360 then tough t*tty, thems the breaks when you void your own warranty on any product).
Repeatedly bringing up the point that the 1st SKU of Xbox 360 had a relatively terrible fail rate is hardly very meaningful now.
They stopped selling that SKU about 2yrs ago.
Xbox 360s sold now have not only a reliability that the PS3 drones cannot bash
(other than to make baseless allegations…..all the other ’sources’ dried up long ago)
but do indeed come with an industry leading warranty.
As CarlB rightly says, if the opposition producer’s product(s) are so good how come they only (at best) offer 1yr deals (and in the USA it’s anything from 30, 60 or 90 days, right)?
Unless you’re going to buy into the ludicrous fantasy that everyone else is making a 100% perfect product 100% of the time then that inevitably must leave certain owners of the opposition’s product high and dry come 31, 61, 91 days or 1yr and 1 day.
Why on earth are the (rareky Wii fans but almost always) PS3 drones lining up to slam the Microsoft deal instead of demanding a similar one for themselves?
How f*cked up is that?
Surely if PS3 is so reliable it’ll cost Sony peanuts and do a ot for their own image?
Few issues in the current gaming scene illustrate how detached from reality & out there and on their own the PS3 fanboy clan is.
When someone like Spideydog wants to imagine that the so-called ‘Xbots’ are just the same & as bad as the PS3 fanboys it’s issues like this that prove that notion wrong.
April 28th, 2009
“Repeatedly bringing up the point that the 1st SKU of Xbox 360 had a relatively terrible fail rate is hardly very meaningful now.
They stopped selling that SKU about 2yrs ago.”
Happy, the E74 Errors JUST happened last week…..meaning systems are STILL failing…not as high as a rate as the 1st SKU, but still in the high double digit percentiles….<—arguing this only adds to the fact of being a blind fanboy
Now granted, yes it is covered by this magical 3 year warranty that you love to cling too and hide behind, BUT you also asked, along with CarlB: Why don’t Sony and Nintendo offer this as well.
And the answer, is simple. Maybe too simple for you guys to understand? They don’t offer because of the following two intertwined reasons:
1. They don’t HAVE to ( i.e are not forced to the way MS was…) because of..
2. They did not build a faulty product ( yes its not 100% BUT it is WELL BELOW industry standards)
See, what you guys are forgetting is that these 3 years deals are costing MS BILLIONS of dollars, something, quite frankly Sony and Nintendo ( well maybe Nintendo ) couldn’t or cannot afford, so instead of relying on Bill Gates’ infinite wallet, they actually had to be competitive and build an actually functioning, LOW, VERY LOW faulty machine…<—wow, would you look at that, an electronic hardware company actually caring about the ….gasp…QUALITY of their hardware….
All in all, yes the MS warranty is great, BUT it only exists because of MS failed attempts to 1) cover up the RROD numbers/and now fear the same backlash of e74 numbers 2) MS failed to produce a quality console ( <–in terms of manufacturing, buddy )
The reason this is constantly being brought up is because most MS fanboys ( especially Happy) Defend this as a positive for MS, when indeed it is their most negative topic, i.e, the more you defend MS about this, the more the other camp will attack it, because quite frankly, your on the losing side of this particular debate, best you can say is : yeah MS fucked up on hardware manufacturing, and just leave it at that lol, just like Sony boyz have to suck it up and say: Yes, bottom line is, we are the most expensive hardware out atm…
April 28th, 2009
jojo29:
“Happy, the E74 Errors JUST happened last week…..meaning systems are STILL failing…not as high as a rate as the 1st SKU, but still in the high double digit percentiles….<—arguing this only adds to the fact of being a blind fanboy”
No, you are in fact being the one who is dancing around the subject like a fanboy trying to ‘fit’ the facts to your PS3 fanboy agenda.
The facts are that after one or more XBL updates ’some’ Xboxes started showing E74 errors.
The fact that this is again largely confined to those original Xenon Xboxes is a fact you prefer to ignore so that you can pretend that all Xboxes still have a problem.
You have nothing but empty inuendo to throw at the later Falcon and Jasper SKU.
Which is laughable.
I’m not “clinging” to anything btw.
The 3yr warranty is a matter of fact that exists for Xbox and not for any other console.
You’re still left arguing agaionst one for any alternative choice.
That’s ridiculous.
….and admit it, you’re only doing it because it suits your agenda in the light of the practices and standards of the CE corp & it’s product you, er, ‘love’.
Even when it’s contrary to your own consumer interests.
There’s the very definition of ‘fanboy’ for you.
Any other consumer rights you enjoy you’d care to oppose to make life easier for your ‘beloved’?
LMAO
April 28th, 2009
Happy
im not opposed to the 3 yr warranty. you are reaching happy, laughably reaching there.
I’ve showed you FACTS about your ‘beloved Falcon/Jasper” series, after you asked for them, and you wrote off the tester as “biased”….spoken like a true blind fanboy….keep reaching though, its funny to see you try
April 28th, 2009
jojo29
Seriously my friend go back and look at your quote…..and while you’re at it have a look at what I actually said and not what you imagine I said.
Firstly I did not call the tester biased at all.
Secondly and far more importantly what you ’showed’ was a guy giving a table of comparative power consumption.
That’s all.
You did not ’show’ anything like what you originally tried to say.
The truth is you are still trying to manipulate and edit to imply something that is not true.
You can claim the high ground if you like but it’s only you saying it.
You have made several claims and none of them stand scrutiny at all.
That’s gone beyond funny my friend and it’s becoming more than a little sad.
April 28th, 2009
@SW and jojo29,
“If it is, then its flawed.”
“1. They don’t HAVE to ( i.e are not forced to the way MS was…) because of..
2. They did not build a faulty product ( yes its not 100% BUT it is WELL BELOW industry standards)
something, quite frankly Sony and Nintendo ( well maybe Nintendo ) couldn’t or cannot afford”
First off, I do not care whether they have to, it is what I would prefer as a potential customer for any of my CE purchases. When/if I buy a PS3/Wii or anything else applicable, I would prefer to have a 3 year warranty. Even cars can come with a 10 year/100,000 mile warranty, and I’m pretty sure they have some pretty fair failure rates as well. CE products in many ways are getting less reliable instead of more so over time, and this should not be a trend with advancing technology.
And yes jojo, Nintendo could very well afford this right now, but I can understand your point that Sony may not be able to, which may be very accurate.
That said, as a consumer I would much rather have a 3 year warranty free of charge on any CE product I buy vice a 30, 60, 90 day or 1 year warranty.
If I bought a Wii or PS3 and was one of the 3% whose console’s broke down (through no fault of my own) and it was outside of the relatively short warranty, I would be pissed as I listened to Sony brag about their product’s reliability in comparison to Microsoft, yet they couldn’t even match their warranty and take care of me. Especially if it was Nintendo, because they can damn sure afford it with all the money they are making.
April 28th, 2009
HH If you think MS would have given a 3 year warranty if it wasn’t for the RROD then your an idiot.
When the 360 launched it had a standard warranty and only increased it because of the RROD.
LOL
April 28th, 2009
I hate to repeat myself, but again: nobody is complaining about the 3 year warranty. They’re complaining about the NECESSITY of it.
-Arvis
April 28th, 2009
Who wants to bet that the next Xbox will not have a 3 year warranty?
April 28th, 2009
Exactly Arvis.
Arvis, Did you get a PSN invite from me?
Or is someone else using that name?
April 28th, 2009
““1. They don’t HAVE to ( i.e are not forced to the way MS was…) because of..”
While its true no one put a gun to thier head, it was really the only hand they could play. Great way to piss off your earlier adopters by saying ‘hah your is OOW, go fuck yourself, please buy another Xbox and more games!!!!!!’, many of them probably wouldn’t have.
We knew they fucked up, they knew they fucked up, it was a nice peice of damage control and it was the ‘right’ thing to do. But it wouldn’t exist if they didn’t create a console prone to failure in the first place, that is the point other people here are trying to hammer home…
I dunno if there is anything else to be said now lol
Oh and finnnnnalllly!
‘(and in the USA it’s anything from 30, 60 or 90 days, right)?’
Wha?
h**p://www.us.playstation.com/Support/Warranties/PS3
“Sony Computer Entertainment America (”SCEA”) warrants to the original purchaser that the PS3™ hardware shall be free from material defects in material and workmanship for a period of one (1) year from the original date of purchase (the “Warranty Period”).”
h**p://www.nintendo.com/consumer/manuals/warrantytext_eng.jsp
“Nintendo of America Inc. (”Nintendo”) warrants to the original purchaser that the hardware product shall be free from defects in material and workmanship for twelve (12) months from the date of purchase.”
No idea where the 90 day stuff came from.
April 28th, 2009
“1. They don’t HAVE to ( i.e are not forced to the way MS was…) because of..”
While its true no one put a gun to thier head, it was really the only hand they could play. Great way to piss off your earlier adopters by saying ‘hah your is OOW, go fuck yourself, please buy another Xbox and more games!!!!!!’, many of them probably wouldn’t have.
We knew they fucked up, they knew they fucked up, it was a nice peice of damage control and it was the ‘right’ thing to do. But it wouldn’t exist if they didn’t create a console prone to failure in the first place, that is the point other people here are trying to hammer home…
I dunno if there is anything else to be said now lol
Oh and finnnnnalllly!
‘(and in the USA it’s anything from 30, 60 or 90 days, right)?’
Wha?
us.playstation.com/Support/Warranties/PS3
“Sony Computer Entertainment America (”SCEA”) warrants to the original purchaser that the PS3™ hardware shall be free from material defects in material and workmanship for a period of one (1) year from the original date of purchase (the “Warranty Period”).”
nintendo.com/consumer/manuals/warrantytext_eng.jsp
“Nintendo of America Inc. (”Nintendo”) warrants to the original purchaser that the hardware product shall be free from defects in material and workmanship for twelve (12) months from the date of purchase.”
No idea where the 90 day stuff came from.
GAWDDDDDDDDDDD I hate the moderation crap on this website. Jeez, lighten up a little with your URL blocking and smiley stuffs…
April 28th, 2009
@ SW,
1 year. Great. Which would you rather have for your PS3/Wii? A three year warranty or a 1 year warranty?
April 28th, 2009
You guys are missing the point. It has been laid out you guys rather simply:
“Arvis:
nobody is complaining about the 3 year warranty. They’re complaining about the NECESSITY of it.”
The 3 year warranty is NOT “given” to you MS fanboys. Its a neccessity due to the FACT the 360 has a HORRIBLE failure rate, even in its NEWEST SKU, it is having double digit failure rates. That is the SOLE REASON MS is slapping the 3 year warranty on it, to cover their own mistake <—-this point cannot be argued, it’s fact.
Now, you saying that Ninty/Sony SHOULD have a 3 year warranty? That is ludicrious because their systems are not only covered for 1 year, their systems DO NOT die within less than a months worth of playtime for the 360. Remember, that 16% failure is for CE products that LAST THREE TO FOUR YEARS, not 30 DAYS. The 360 is dying before even the 30 day warranty!!!
“Ncaissie:
When the 360 launched it had a standard warranty and only increased it because of the RROD.”
Again, the 3 year is ONLY IN THERE to cover up their HUGE FAILURE of a mistake, and we are simply pointing that out. You MS fanboys want to credit MS for ‘doing the right thing’, when in fact they did NOT do the right thing in the first place: make a quality console to begin with. Its good that MS is offering that 3 year warranty, but is it credit worth? NO, it is not because of the said facts.
SW:
But it wouldn’t exist if they didn’t create a console prone to failure in the first place, that is the point other people here are trying to hammer home…
I dunno if there is anything else to be said now lol
Exactly the point we are trying to make. That warranty would not exist if the console was made with quality in mind, but it wasn’t.
In case my point is NOT clear in this post, read up to SWs post, he nailed right on the head.
Ok, now back to Happy…happy, what to do with you my blindboy….
“Secondly and far more importantly what you ’showed’ was a guy giving a table of comparative power consumption.
That’s all.”
That is all? <—this right here shows you know nothing on how computers/console run. If you have read the whole article, or just have common sense, lower power consumption equals LESS heat…your blind not deaf, Less power = less heat…
What revelance does that have? Well, one of the major factors of why the 360 was RROD was….ta da! HEAT…one more time now…HEAT..So what does that have to do with Falcon and Jasper?
Everything my friend. Falcon and Jasper were meant to use less power thus produce less heat, in order to STOP the RROD…but they failed…
How so..well this ‘test’ that you want to shrug off so quickly, shows the exact power consumption and percentage of heat actually reduced. Microsoft claimed i believe in the article a 30% or 50% drop in heat…guess what the actual numbers were? Anandtech<—a VERY reputable computer HARDWARE site, found the new Falcons/Jaspers only reduced heat by 15%…..which equals to about 5-8 degrees….THATS why 360s with Falcon/Jasper cores are still having RROD issues and now E74 issues….
“You did not ’show’ anything like what you originally tried to say.”
Again, i presented you with facts like you asked, and just like i said you would, you deny them and just make yourself look like a blind fanboy trying to defend the single point where MS is dead wrong….if it was quantity of games were debating i would have conceded that MS does indeed have a larger library, but thats not the case, MS makes a faulty console, EVEN TODAY, whose failure rates are in the double digits ( 16-30%) and yet you still defend them….if that is not a blind fanboy….
“The truth is you are still trying to manipulate and edit to imply something that is not true.”
Sorry Happy the truth is, i gave you exactly what you wanted, you just can’t handle the truth…sorry blindboy, the truth hurts don’t it :O again im done with you
April 28th, 2009
@CarlB
“1 year. Great. Which would you rather have for your PS3/Wii? A three year warranty or a 1 year warranty?”
It’s funny now you are downplaying Sony and Nintendo for actually making a console that lasts longer than their warranty….damn it CarlB i thought you were better than this…
I would MUCH rather have a 1 year warranty with a console with a 3% failure rate, than a console with a 3 year warranty with a 30% failure rate.
Remember that 16% from the latest article was for CE products in their 3RD to 4RTH years, 360s dont even last ONE month….you do the math for years….
You know what that 3 year warranty does for Nintendo and Sony’s Failure rates? If Sony and Nintendo had a 3 year warranty, they can then claim their systems have a 1% failure rate.
April 28th, 2009
@CarlB
Also by your logic, as long as a CE product has a 3 year warranty, it doesn’t matter how shoddy the quality of it is to you then right? We can have cars with 10k/10 year warranties that break break trannys and burn through engines every 3 months right? Because hey, we can just take it back, and wait the 3-4 days to get it fixed…but o wait…how will we get to work….
But it doesn’t matter because its covered right? With this logic, as long as a CE product is covered in warranty, who cares if its supposed to work out of the box, hey if you open it, turn it on and see a puff a smoke, just send it back right? Who cares if you have to wait that much longer….
April 28th, 2009
@Carlb
“1 year. Great. Which would you rather have for your PS3/Wii? A three year warranty or a 1 year warranty?”
Can I pick %95+ reliable units with the one year please?
You also forget that its limited (well I would say MOST/all warranties are limited, but this is just limited to RRoD/e74 stuffs) . If your drive fails after your first year I *believe* its not covered and you’re fucked (well you could go buy another drive and try to extract the key from your existing one, or just send it back to MS I suppose…)…
Again, no one is saying the warranty sucks balls, no one is saying, hey if Sony/Nintendo said ‘3 years all around boyz!!!!’, no one here would say no to it. But of course we would want to know why (e.g cell processors explode %85 of the time or something.)…
We’re just saying hey, the 3 year *very limited* warranty is nice, but if they had created a unit that was NOT failing in the early days (note how i don’t say all the new shit is failing because fuck, who knows?!?) then it would NOT have been needed and you they NEVER would have offered it up for free.
April 28th, 2009
@SW
You said it better than i could have, bravo!
April 28th, 2009
“hey if Sony/Nintendo said ‘3 years all around boyz!!!!’, no one here would say no to it.”
My point exactly gentlemen. I am not “downplaying” Nintendo or Sony for not having it, I applaud them for their low failure rate on their consoles, and I would also prefer to buy one with a 3 year limited warranty vice a 1 year.
They don’t have to because they are not in the hot seat and have no pressure to do so, I understand. I am just saying I would hate to be that 1-3 out of 100 who is left with a non-working console after 1 year through no fault of my own and not be covered.
Would we be arguing like this if all consoles had 3 year limited warranties standard? No, because 1 year is what we have been conditioned to think is “right” (well, maybe we would be arguing because one had a 6 year due to higher failure rates… who knows?).
It probably won’t happen and I understand why, it would just be a “nice-to-have”… you know? I personally would prefer it to say… something like Home or something else I wouldn’t use or do not care for, but that is just my opinion.
April 28th, 2009
So then you must be talking about optional extended warranties! (if they even have them – interesting idea I have to say).
Because what your, happy’s, my & everyone elses 360 have is NOT an extension of you bog standard HW warranty.
If my wii breaks after 1 year due to drive failure I’m just as fucked as if my 360 breaks after 1 year due to drive failure.
So in your case, if your 360 broke in any ‘normal’ way (so i’m talking the % that do NOT fail due to RRoD/E74, but do fail) then you’re just as boned.
Well, unless you force it to RRoD with a towel… I guess at least we have that option. *grin*
Oh and I never said you were downplaying the other warranties, just that we were’nt saying MS’s 3yr limited sucks a fat one (which is does not). Whilst its true you don’t direct that comment at me, its directly after a quote from me…
April 28th, 2009
“Spideydog
Oh well, I’ll just have to find a way to live with the the fact we agree to disagree then. Nevermind, that’s what adults do, right?”
Roger that
April 28th, 2009
jojo29:
“your Jasper/Falcon units are NOT the end all be all of problems…
It netted a mer 12% drop in heat ROFL, there goes your proof….
If its only 12% more efficient, i highly doubt that RROD is 100% gone, in fact i bet with these changes it dropped down to 15%-20%…i found my proof wheres YOURS…still waiting on you blind fanboy ….
The Falcon to Jasper transition isn’t quite as dramatic unfortunately. I ran five power tests, I looked at power consumption at the NXE dashboard at idle, power consumption at the main menu of Rockband 2, Halo 3 and Gears of War 2, and finally if you don’t own any of these games but want a comparison point I looked at power consumption of the Xbox 360 while running the BioShock demo (at the very start of the demo when you find yourself in the water surrounded by fire). Power consumption during actual gameplay doesn’t go up much, if at all, compared to the start screens for these games – the main menu screens are all rendered in 3D and are apparently just as stressful as the games themselves, plus they’re a very consistent way of measuring power consumption.
I used a Watts-Up meter which the Xbox 360 plugged into, so what we’re looking at here is total system power consumption.
Xbox 360 Revision System Off Idle Halo 3 Rockband 2 Gears of War 2 BioShock Demo
Xenon 2.3W 155.7W 177.8W 167.7W 177.1W 172W
Falcon 2.8W 101.4W 121.2W 112.8W 121.5W 115.5W
Jasper 2.0W 93.7W 105.9W 101.0W 105.9W 98.1W
Overall you’re looking at a 12% reduction in total system power under load and under 8% at idle, definitely not the ~30 – 35% drop we saw with the Xenon to Falcon transition, but not insignificant either. Remember that the smaller your transistors get, the more leakage current becomes a problem; while your transistors use less power, they also tend to use more power when they are in a logical off state than they should. There have also been a number of advancements in architecting for low power designs over the past couple of years that Microsoft hasn’t taken advantage of as they would require a redesign of the 360’s CPU/GPU. Microsoft is in full blown cost savings mode with the Xbox 360, the only things that will be done to that console before it dies are things to improve the Xbox division’s bottom line.”
h**p://www.anandtech.com/gadgets/showdoc.aspx?i=3472&p=5
There’s your quote jojo29.
Nowhere does it say anything about the Falcon & Jasper reliability.
It does give a table of relative power consumption between the models.
You then start your own guessing and supposition (turning the Jasper’s 12% lower power draw into a claim that –
“It netted a mer 12% drop in heat”
which the article does not say.
Besides the 12% drop is between Falcon & Jasper.
The drop from Xenon to Falcon was 30 – 35%.
Falcon never did have the fail rates of the original Xenon so your attempt to claim that a small drop in power use means nothing is totally bogus.
Like I already said, Falcon already fixed the RROD numbers. Falcon brought in the smaller CPU and a smaller GPU & RAM.
Like I already said.
Jasper makes small improvements but is as the article says largely about production cost savings, as I’ve already mentioned.
If you’re going to talk like a game-playing idiot child then there really is no point in discussing this further.
You have tried to claim that the small difference in power draw between Falcon & Jasper means nothing in regard to heat reduction compared to the troublesome Xenon SKU.
That is plainly quite wrong and rather dishonest.
Similarly (and typically without a shred of data to support your claim) you now claim E74 is affecting large numbers of Falcon & Jasper models.
OK then, prove it.
Prove that that is the case seeing as you are the one making the claim.
Instead of now trying to shout about a direct relationship between power use and heat (without paying the slightest attention to the different cooling systems introduced between the Xenon and the Falcon) why not just man up and admit that in your haste to grab anything from the net to attempt to back your case you f*cked up. Badly.
It happens.
Get over it.
April 29th, 2009
“Nowhere does it say anything about the Falcon & Jasper reliability.”
The fact that they still run hot questions their reliability, due to the fact that HEAT is one of the main causes of the RROD…<—how can you not see that?
“Falcon never did have the fail rates of the original Xenon so your attempt to claim that a small drop in power use means nothing is totally bogus.”
The fact that RROD and NOW E74 issues are still running rampant disprove this pathetic fanboy claim…PROVE that the Falcons ARE NOT failing, because 360s are still dying out there buddy…
“Like I already said, Falcon already fixed the RROD numbers. Falcon brought in the smaller CPU and a smaller GPU & RAM.
Like I already said.
Jasper makes small improvements but is as the article says largely about production cost savings, as I’ve already mentioned.”
Again, Falcon did make “improvements” but it did NOT FIX anything, and neither has Jasper…Are they less prone to RROD/E74? Maybe, thats for YOU to PROVE because as it stands right now, at this moment in time, according to last weeks articles, RROD is STILL an issue, and now we have a new one on top of that: E74…This is RECENT news, meaning Jasper and Falcon units are out there.
So the average person, one can surmise: “Hey, didn’t MS released their new Falcons?Jaspers?”
Yes they did.
“Weren’t they supposed to FIX (<–your word not mine) the RROD issue? And what is this E74 thing? another issue? I guess Jasper/Falcon fixed nothing”
Now, until YOU PROVE that the defective units are NOT Falcon/Jasper, my point stands: Falcon/Jasper did NOT FIX any thing regarding the RROD is still around as well as the new E74..
Now regarding total RROD issues…are they lessened…yes, i can say they have lessened. BUT, the RROD combined with the new E74 issues, bring back MS failure rates way past the single digit failure rate percentage, it could well be WAY past the 16% MS claims….
April 29th, 2009
I agree, with launch undoubtedly a reliability fiasco, it is up to MS and the Xbots to prove that it is fixed. They can’t, because it isn’t.
4 jaspers have fallen in my group of geek friends: 2 to RRoD, 2 to Disc Drive Failure. There goes my hope for a reliable 360 this gen.
April 29th, 2009
@SW,
“So then you must be talking about optional extended warranties!”
No, I am talking about company standard 3 year warranties with the purchase of their product (as the 1 year is standard now). You can get extended warranties through retailers presently by paying extra, but that is not what I am talking about.
“If my wii breaks after 1 year due to drive failure I’m just as fucked as if my 360 breaks after 1 year due to drive failure.”
Ideally, the “limited warranty” would cover whatever happened to be the most common problem with that hardware regardless of overall failure rates. In other words if you have 3% failure rate and say, a yellow LED flashes (and the console cannot function, the problem cannot be resolved by the customer, let say Ivan’s problem with his PS3 is the most common amongst whatever percentage of PS3’s fail) instead of a RRoD/E74, you would still be covered outside of a year up to 3 years and still be covered via a refund of your money if the same problem occurred again outside of that three years (as is the case with 360 and an overheating mobo).
April 29th, 2009
Ugh, now you’ve gone and made me re-read both mine and your own posts from earlier, damn you! *shakes fist*
‘No, I am talking about company standard 3 year warranties *snip*’
Yeah I was just being a smartass, I knew what you were talking about very much so.
Anyways, this seems to have to turned from a 360 warranty because thier build quality sucked into a what we would like from warranty. Or something.
So if you’ll excuse me i’d rather be slamming the head of my penis in a fridge door.
April 29th, 2009
Oh dear, still unable to admit it & fighting the rear-guard action, wheedling away trying to save face, huh?
OK, seeing as you’re so slow on this let’s go through it …..
“The fact that they still run hot questions their reliability, due to the fact that HEAT is one of the main causes of the RROD…<—how can you not see that?”
Falcon & Jasper do not “run hot”.
I know this from my own experience; I get very cool air out of my own Falcon even when it’s been run for hours.
Sorry but that is purely your own invention.
Nowhere does your article say that they do
(no temps are given at all in fact).
Neither are materials mentioned nor heat pipes, radiators and ducts all of which chnged enormously between the original Xenon SKU & the later Falcon & Jasper.
If you think the materials used and the cooling systems used don’t come into this then you’re just being idiotic.
“The fact that RROD and NOW E74 issues are still running rampant disprove this pathetic fanboy claim…PROVE that the Falcons ARE NOT failing, because 360s are still dying out there buddy…”
No, you prove that the effected units are Falcons & Jaspers.
It’s you that has made this claim without a shred of evidence.
“Again, Falcon did make “improvements” but it did NOT FIX anything, and neither has Jasper…Are they less prone to RROD/E74? Maybe, thats for YOU to PROVE because as it stands right now, at this moment in time, according to last weeks articles, RROD is STILL an issue, and now we have a new one on top of that: E74…This is RECENT news, meaning Jasper and Falcon units are out there.”
Er, no.
You seem to be (deliberately?) confusing yourself here.
These problems are indeed recent (one or more of the recent XBL updates is thought to be involved) but they relate largely to the earlier units (as all the problems have done).
I don’t have to prove ‘jack s’ about this.
You’re the one trying to claim “Falcon did ….. NOT FIX anything, and neither has Jasper”
“So the average person, one can surmise: “Hey, didn’t MS released their new Falcons?Jaspers?” ”
LMAO
You want to base this on your ’surmising’ and your own view that because a problem arose recently then that must mean it relates to the most recently sold models!?
Amazing logic there, brains.
Not.
“Now, until YOU PROVE that the defective units are NOT Falcon/Jasper, my point stands”
No it doesn’t.
Firstly you are the one making the (comnpletely evidence free) allegation.
Secondly your claim that becuase this happened recently it must be about Falcon & Jasper models is illogical.
The XBL update(s) thought to have triggered this were indeed recent but that hardly means the problem must have arisen largely in the recent SKUs.
“Falcon/Jasper did NOT FIX any thing regarding the RROD is still around as well as the new E74..”
OK, nice allegation. Go ahead & prove that.
“the RROD combined with the new E74 issues, bring back MS failure rates way past the single digit failure rate percentage, it could well be WAY past the 16% MS claims….”
Instead of making your silly groundless speculations why not try and back your claims up with some evidence?
Sorry jojo29 but you’re still doing nothing but whining and throwing any old unrelated or unsubstantiated mud around and hoping it sticks.
Fail.
SW
When was the last time you ever had a CD/DVD drive fail on you?
Personally, I can honestly say never.
April 29th, 2009
Dude, are you like, 45 and trying to be hip like the kids or something? “Fail” hasn’t been anything but annoying and groan worthy for years now (unless you are a lolcats fool)
April 29th, 2009
JofaMang
1) I’m not ‘trying to be cool’ with anyone.
2) you’ve clearly mistaken me for someone who gives a f*ck.
April 29th, 2009
Happy, again, i point you to this:
“The fact that they still run hot questions their reliability, due to the fact that HEAT is one of the main causes of the RROD…<—how can you not see that?”
Power consumption is directly tied to heat…So, if the Xenon boards ran EXTREMELY hot, which was one of the causes of the RROD, MS figured in order to REDUCE heat, they need better POWER solution…Falcon was a nice improvement, BUT it was NOT enough…Jasper was less of an improvement and more a costs savings for MS….
So by gathering that, and the FACTS that 360s are STILL RRODing and E74, i don’t have to PROVE anything, it proved itself
now if this is true:
JofaMang:4 jaspers have fallen in my group of geek friends: 2 to RRoD, 2 to Disc Drive Failure. There goes my hope for a reliable 360 this gen.
That is just FURTHER evidence….Its funny Happy, again i have your proof, no its not hard numbers or facts stated by MS, its all based on common sense, combined with a little bit of knowledge, something you lack dearly, why? Because you so blindly eat up whatever MS creams you with, and like i stated earlier, defending this is a losing argument for you, as MS hardware failure rates are already well known throughout the industry, and CONTINUE to haunt them…
Jasper and Falcon have done NOTHING to alleviate the RROD/E74 problem<—THEY ARE RRODing/E74 <—this is FACT, not speculation, not conjured up by my imagination because i hate MS, its just a sad FACT that you cannot see, why well, because you blindly swallow whatever MS gives you….
Like i’ve stated, i am a fanboy, but not so much as to put off Sony’s past mistakes, nor do i hate MS so much as i want them out of the gaming industry, the way you seem you want Sony out of it….
Once again, i can show you all the “proof’, you want, you simply don’t like the truth and you can’t handle it, so i challenge you:
If you post another stab at my comments, without showing “proof” that Falcons/Jaspers are NOT RRODing/E74s AT ALL, like you think, then just stop posting, as you are not bringing anything meaningful and are just spouting fanboy claims, so i await the proof that Falcons/Jaspers and 360s are NOT RRODING/E74….Good luck with that, posters like JofaMang, who have had friend’s Jasper/Falcon units recently fail on them to prove wrong….
April 29th, 2009
I can’t offer anything more than anecdotal evidence, but as I have discussed before, this is all the proof I need to stay away from this product.
I also have full faith in MS producing a top quality console in the next round. I will probably still wait 6mo to a year before purchasing, but I have no doubt that MS will have learned from their mistakes.
April 29th, 2009
Do you have to work hard at coming up with this series of half-truths and allegation or is it some of a gift?
jojo29:
“Power consumption is directly tied to heat…”
No, whilst that is in part true it is nothing like the whole story.
As even the most basic knowledge of physics and electronics ought to tell you.
Power consumption alone is not as directly related to heat as you want to imply.
Heat depends on several other things as well as mere power consumption.
Why do you keep pretending this is not so?
“So, if the Xenon boards ran EXTREMELY hot, which was one of the causes of the RROD”
You’ve missed out entirely the point about the materials used in the Xenon GPU which were as much a cause of the troubles.
How come?
“MS figured in order to REDUCE heat, they need better POWER solution”
Wrong.
As evidenced by the fact that they did not just reduce the power consumption with a smaller 65nm CPU.
They also changed a lot of the mobo layout, the GPU materials, they changed the airflow ducting, altered the heat-piping and reduced the die size of the RAM as well as shrinking the GPU.
“Falcon was a nice improvement, BUT it was NOT enough”
Prove it.
You can’t.
You’re just making empty allegations, as usual.
“Jasper was less of an improvement and more a costs savings for MS”
Er, I already said that long ago. Was that supposed to be news?
“So by gathering that, and the FACTS”
You haven’t given any facts.
You’re just offering up one long allegation (very poorly) tied to another.
Just because ‘it all fits’ (in your head) that doesn’t make it true or in any way logical.
Quite clearly you and logic are total strangers.
“360s are STILL RRODing and E74, i don’t have to PROVE anything”
You do if you’re going to make unfounded allegations that
“Falcon did ….. NOT FIX anything, and neither has Jasper”
You have not one shred of proof of this.
“it proved itself”
That’s a joke, surely? (it ought to be if it wasn’t intended to be)
” now if this is true:
JofaMang:4 jaspers have fallen in my group of geek friends: 2 to RRoD, 2 to Disc Drive Failure. There goes my hope for a reliable 360 this gen.”
Yeah right.
Just like my 3 relatives with PS3s and my 4 mates with them all suffered them locking up and bursting into flames last night.
See, anyone can pull that sort of nonsensical unprovable anecdotal BS out of their a$$.
“That is just FURTHER evidence….”
No, no it’s not.
It’s called anecdote and it is neither “evidence” nor proof of a single thing.
Are you about 5 jojo29?
You’re talking/debating like a 5yr old.
“Its funny Happy, again i have your proof”
More garbage.
Grandstand over your own comments all you like but you have been remarkably unable to provide a single ounce of actual evidence.
Even when you linked you got caught out having to squirm and wriggle and pretend the link says something it doesn’t.
“no its not hard numbers or facts stated by MS”
LMAO
At last a genuine factual statement.
Hooray!
“its all based on common sense, combined with a little bit of knowledge”
Oh dear, stop it, my sides just started to split and my head is in danger of falling off.
“Because you so blindly eat up whatever MS creams you with”
Well a PS3 fanboy outburst wouldn’t be complete without the typical adolescent latent gay imagery.
Very amusing, if a little more revealing than you meant.
“defending this is a losing argument for you, as MS hardware failure rates are already well known throughout the industry, and CONTINUE to haunt them…”
If this is so then why are you so singularly unable to post a singular thing that either is based on empirical evidence?
Why are all your comments nothing but, when it comes down to it, just your own empty rhetoric, dishonest quoting and evidence-less allegation?
“Jasper and Falcon have done NOTHING to alleviate the RROD/E74 problem”
Prove it then.
Prove the Xbox problems are as bad as they ever were.
You can’t.
You’re just being a fanboy berk again.
“THEY ARE RRODing/E74 <—this is FACT”
I have never said that there are absolutely no Falcons or Jaspers failing (from either malody).
I did say that no-one ever made a 100% perfect product 100% of the time.
That was never the debate.
The debate centred around your dishonest quote and claim that
“Falcon did ….. NOT FIX anything, and neither has Jasper”
Now you’ve chosen to add some more lunacy –
“Jasper and Falcon have done NOTHING to alleviate the RROD/E74 problem”
You said that, not me and because you refuse to admit you were wrong you continue to make a t*t of yourself shouting idiotic and unrelated BS.
“Like i’ve stated, i am a fanboy”
You could have just stopped there, saved us all the bother and moved on.
Oh well.
Nevermind.
April 29th, 2009
I didn’t read your entire post (too long and repetitive) but I did notice the lack of a “Fail” comment.
Kudos.
April 29th, 2009
Happy:”The debate centred around your dishonest quote and claim that
“Falcon did ….. NOT FIX anything, and neither has Jasper””
Then prove it did fix something….
360s with Falcon/Jasper units are still failing, as evidenced by the recent E74 errors and the continuous string of RROD errors, not not as abundant as launch, but still well withing the double digits…
“JofaMang:4 jaspers have fallen in my group of geek friends: 2 to RRoD, 2 to Disc Drive Failure. There goes my hope for a reliable 360 this gen.”
Yeah right.
Just like my 3 relatives with PS3s and my 4 mates with them all suffered them locking up and bursting into flames last night.
See, anyone can pull that sort of nonsensical unprovable anecdotal BS out of their a$$.”
Well, in this regards we should all just stop posting, no matter what any side brings, it will be wrapped up as “anecdotal” by your 4 year old brain…..if anyone is bringing up BS its you happy, you are a hypocrit you ask for facts and evidence, i bring what i can, because quite frankly, MS nor Sony would ever release hard numbers, yet when i ask the same of you you provide nothing, not even one shrewd of “anecdotal” evidence<—which would actually be something..
Anyways, go ahead and write off poster’s experience as “anecdotal”, my brother is on his 4rth 360, which he had bought his 3rd one, around the time Gears 2 came out, relatively new model, not sure exaclty which, and now we have not only Jofa’s “anecdotal” claim but a recent article based on the E74 errors…
Yes you did say no CE product can be 100%, but guess what? At least Sony/Nintendo’s are close, they are at 97%, whereas, taking the lowest reported number the 360 has 16.4, puts it at a 83.6%….ouch! <—again, this is fact
Now, whether those are Falcon/jasper/Eagle or whatever they want to name their units, well, being that the E74 just came to being, one can safely say, it is the Falcons/Jasper…Im saying that they ARE, going along the lines that the article is new, the Falcons/jaspers are already out, and problems are still coming in…
Now, again, either provide the data asked of you, or sit there and cry like the 4yrblindboy that you are.
At least there are some members in here that can see that:) SW/Jofa/CarlBand dare i say it…Ivan…hmmm who puts money Happy says something that i mentioned Ivan.
How is it being the only blind delusional fanboy here? DOn’t answer that, i don’t want you to be anymore confused than you are, just focus on the question of providing the data asked of you….i’ll be waiting…until then Falcon/Jasper are failing, with recent E74 articles proof of this
April 29th, 2009
Happy, despite your insistence to the contrary, you seem to care very deeply about this issue. You could have written a small novel about this by now…
-Arvis
April 29th, 2009
jojo29:
“Then prove it did fix something….”
No, you made the ridiculous allegation, so you’re the one that ought to back up your silly baseless claims.
These are –
“Falcon did ….. NOT FIX anything, and neither has Jasper”
and
“Jasper and Falcon have done NOTHING to alleviate the RROD/E74 problem”
“360s with Falcon/Jasper units are still failing”
You’re quibbling and trying to make a mountain out of a molehill.
No-one ever said not one Jasper or Falcon ever failed.
You’re the one pretending that -
“Falcon did ….. NOT FIX anything, and neither has Jasper”
and
“Jasper and Falcon have done NOTHING to alleviate the RROD/E74 problem”
“when i ask the same of you you provide nothing, not even one shrewd of “anecdotal” evidence<—which would actually be something..”
Er, no.
Anecodte is pretty much worthless as it can be made up on the spot and is invariably unverifiable and/or unprovable.
You alledge all sorts of ridiculous and over-blown nonsense and then expect others to run around & provide proof you’re wrong.
No, that’s not how it works.
You can parrot back what you like but for all that at the end of the day you’re the one making fact-free and rather transparent fanboy ‘points’.
“Yes you did say no CE product can be 100%, but guess what? At least Sony/Nintendo’s are close, they are at 97%”
OK, another one to add to the list, go ahead, show the verifiable data that proves this to be true.
“whereas, taking the lowest reported number the 360 has 16.4″
Yeah, for the 1st Xenon SKU (which btw is well short of the ludicrous 30% claims – or that pre-production BS we were treated to recently).
You have nothing (not even fanboy shop staff tall-tales) for Falcon & Jasper.
“being that the E74 just came to being, one can safely say, it is the Falcons/Jasper”
Again a fact-free illogical leap of your own imagination.
The truth is you just so obviously want it to be Falcons & Jaspers.
Nothing more.
“At least there are some members in here that can see that”
Oh dear, now that is sad; trapped in your own BS you make a feeble appeal to the gallery & see if any of the other resident PS3 fans will come help you out.
“Like i’ve stated, i am a fanboy”
You really couldn’t have put it better.
You really ought to have started and stopped right there.
You’re just repeating yourself now.
Clearly you have absolutely nothing to back your claims.
Get the fork out.
You’re well over done here.
Arvis:
“Happy, despite your insistence to the contrary, you seem to care very deeply about this issue.”
No Arvis, I thought at one point we might actually see something new here.
When jojo29 started on about links that backed him up I had imagined that perhaps he had something interesting.
Sadly no.
Does taking his posts apart point by point mean I “care very deeply”!?
LOL
No, it’s been fun taking the pi$$ from his pi$$-poor debating skills, is all.
The subject could be anything but, seriously, jojo29 couldn’t argue his way out of an open door.
Next up will be some of the usual old sh*te about how he’s ‘just joking’.
Fair enough – but in any serious debate he’d have been kicked off & shown the door long ago.
April 29th, 2009
In any serious debate you wouldn’t have been able to start Happy, all you do is wait for someone to post, then go ahead and point out why it’s wrong without backing your claims, you don’t even try too.
At least on my posts i actually try to explain what i can with what information is out there.
All you do is /point and ridicule and say “nope that doesn’t work” without saying why or debating the contrary.
Again, im waiting for you to back your claims. Ive backed my claims with enough information to support my claim.
Its easy to just /point and say “nope that doesn’t work, your debating skillz suxxorz”
Sorry, if i can actually debate with actual information.
Im still waiting on why Falcon/Jasper units are not contributing to the “16.4%” failure rate that is going on NOW with BOTH RROD/E74
All i have seen you do is /whine, /cry, and /refute any substantial information presented to you. It’s funny, most people agree with what i am saying about the RROD/E74 issue, except you….again which points out you are a rabid blind ms fanboy….
Oh well, again, you have failed to defend yourself with any valid information, so i fear i will have to just wait.
Or i could go ahead and stoop to your level and say:
Next up, will be the usual horse shite about how my post is bs with no proof-but in the real world, and not a forum, you wouldn’t even be allowed on the debate floor, let alone a debate conference….they would have stopped you at the door..
April 29th, 2009
Also as for this:
“No, it’s been fun taking the pi$$ from his pi$$-poor debating skills, is all.
The subject could be anything but, seriously, jojo29 couldn’t argue his way out of an open door. ”
I wish i could do the same, but you don’t provide any reasonable evidence/posts that need any taking apart, how can i take apart rabid blind fanboy drivel…simply you can’t as there is nothing worth picking out from someone who spews nothing but bs, avoiding the actual topic at hand..
April 29th, 2009
@SW,
“what we would like from warranty”
Yes, SW, but not only that, what would be reasonable from warranty, i.e. having manufacturer’s cover their products most common defect within those that actually do fail for three years. For 360 it is RRoD/E74, for PS3 it could be YLoD/E##, for Wii it could be the same. Probably won’t happen, I know, but it would be nice. Resuming slamming whatever is left of your junk in the fridge door.
April 29th, 2009
jojo29
“Like i’ve stated, i am a fanboy”
You lose.
Game over.
April 29th, 2009
“Resuming slamming whatever is left of your junk in the fridge door.”
Ok, you win the talkback with that. Makes me giggle everytime I read it… Which is odd because is not a funny subject at all… *pets gear*
April 29th, 2009
Happychockum
Why not post the full details on that comment that you posted?
OH thats right, you see and read only what you want….blind fanboy…
sorry, its you who lose..peace out happy:) i enjoyed beating you at your own game
April 30th, 2009
Sorry SW, I meant resume, but it does sound a little more humorous that way…
So jojo, what percentage did you say Falcon/Jasper units contribute to the estimated 16.4%?
April 30th, 2009
The failure rate is actually %160. They even cause electronics around them to fail…
April 30th, 2009
The official term is EMP SW, this is a strategic plan by the NWO to train specific people for the upcoming fallout. These people are then observed, and if they whine and complain instead of following instructions and being grateful for whatever recompense is offered then they do not get the invite to the shelter.
April 30th, 2009
CarlB:
“So jojo, what percentage did you say Falcon/Jasper units contribute to the estimated 16.4%?”
No CarlB, you’re not getting how this works.
It’s now up to you to prove that all 16.4% of those failed units are not Falcon/Jaspers.
April 30th, 2009
No Happy, you are just not getting it. Stop it, please.
CarlB
I have never said that Falcon/Jasper were the full contributors to the 16.4% ( or higher ) fail rate, i was saying that they are in fact contributing to the 16.4% fail rate. Happy over there has been arguing the fact saying that Jasper/Falcon eliminated the RROD/E74 issues when in fact they have not.
Then he asks me to prove the very question you asked me.
To which i pointed him the recent E74/RROD article saying that Hey, 360s are still failing, in fact with a minimum 16.4% failure rate, EVEN with Falcon/Jasper units already out there.
Then he goes on and on about wanting proof and evidence.
Well my evidence is the fact that 360s are still failing, as shown by the recent articles of RROD/E74 issues arising, along with ancedontal support, even from posters like Jofa, saying a couple of his friends, specifically, Jasper units have fried, alongside that my brother’s 360 died after having received a new one right around when Gears of War 2 released, but in that respects im not sure if it was a Jasper or whatever, but the fact that 360s are still dying out there is the point, even with the new revisions out there.
So, then i asked him to prove that Jaspers/Falcons are NOT contributing to the 16.4%/current failure rates, to which he is not able to even bring up any articles/links/anything that supports his claims…because he can’t he instead resorts to picking apart posts and sprouting “thats not possible” like a blindfanboy…
April 30th, 2009
Oh, then he goes on about how Power Consumption is not directly relating to heat….when he is talking to a person who overclocks his CPU, on air cooling alone, and the number one way to not only get a great OC but stable ones at that, is to have your vcore/voltages as low as possible…on air cooling alone i was able to get my E8500 from 3.1Ghz to a nice 3.73ish…but then again, what do i know<–all this is just ancedontal right Happy?
See with this mentality, no one can show/anything to Happy, as he can just write anything anyone says…which is great for him, but not really, as he will not be able to learn anything….poor Happy….
April 30th, 2009
jojo29
Sorry you missed the joke, perhaps a few smilies would have made it as obvious as you need to have it to get it?
I never said Falcon and Jasper have no failures at all. My point is that Xbox fail rates are now normal.
You in fact are the one who – without a shred of evidence – claimed
“Falcon did ….. NOT FIX anything, and neither has Jasper”
and
“Jasper and Falcon have done NOTHING to alleviate the RROD/E74 problem”
Then you go trying to divert the debate with some flannel and waffle about power consumption and heat when you got susses out for dishonestly using a quote.
Lastly and most amusingly of all you then declare yourself as having won the debate.
You ought to have been told long ago
’self praise is no praise at all’.
You could have just left it all with your single most pertinent statement….
“Like i’ve stated, i am a fanboy”
You lose.
Game over.
Get over it.
Fanboy
April 30th, 2009
Would it be reasonable to agree that the Falcon/Jasper units contribute between 1%-3% to that rate at a minimum?
April 30th, 2009
btw, %16.4 was the estimate over a year ago… there is a good chance it is less now.
April 30th, 2009
Prove it, CarlB.
April 30th, 2009
Or more
April 30th, 2009
Who fixed the smilies to instant on??? George? Thank you smiley guy!
April 30th, 2009
CarlB,
That would be a reasonable assumption…but since Happy can’t prove jack shit, who’s to say its not 9-12%?
That’s the bottom line though, is neither can “prove” it like Happy wants to <—thats how he tries to win a debate.
Yet, there is more “evidence” of Xbox failing NOW, than NOT failing, even with the new cores out….<—thats for happy to prove
BUT< CarlB, as for you and me, I would say 3-5% minimum and we are good
May 1st, 2009
Hilarious.
So, in other words, all that f@nnying around boils down to you agreeing (with someone else) that Xbox Jasper & Falcon, (by your guesstimation and free of any actual evidence, either way) have fail rates are around 3 – 5%.
About the industry norm.
….and you wonder why I ridicule you PS3 fanboys.
May 1st, 2009
Happy,
the difference is:
CarlB, actually brings up great points, without resorting to flaming posts, or bringing up blindfanboyism into the topic.
He “gets” what i was trying to say, yet was able to ‘defend’ Jasper/Falcon in such a way, that we both were able to agree on a middle ground….
and you wonder why no one listens to you…
May 1st, 2009
jojo29
The only fanboy in this has been you.
By your own admission –
“Like i’ve stated, i am a fanboy”
Pathetic.
But seeing as the last word is so obviously that big a deal to you, go ahead and back-track some more.
May 1st, 2009
jojo29:
“and you wonder why no one listens to you…”
LMAO
In your own head I guess you’re revered around here with reverential respect, huh?
Up your own ar$e, much?
May 1st, 2009
Hypocrite much? It looks as though you need the last word.
I don’t think im revered here or anything, but i think i’ve garnered enough respect that CarlB was able to have a discussion with me without resorting to insults, like yourself…
Also, you seem to love quoting my ” I am fanboy” but not quoting the rest of that phrase.
Its ok, thats what i expect from you anyways, you lack the ability to fully read and understand what someone posts, especially if it goes against Microsoft’s Xbox 360…I forgive you though, Happy, i know some people like yourself, just are impaired and can’t help it, good luck to you
May 1st, 2009
LMAO.
Too easy.
May 2nd, 2009
Ok, who’s rubber and who’s glue?